Why doesn't Israel want an independent investigation of Gaza 2018 border events?



The official story is that there is a violent riot. And that the sniper acts appropriately (source)

However, Israel refuses to allow independent investigators to corroborate the stories.

Why does't Israel want to corroborate their official story?


Posted 2018-04-15T02:55:33.943

Reputation: 1

Question was closed 2018-04-15T09:56:36.703

3Maybe Israel doesn't believe that the "independent investigators" are truly independent. There is constant anti-Semitism at the UN, and there is rising anti-Semitism in Europe. Maybe the thought of UN & EU reps investigating Israeli military operations raises some suspicion. – Michael Benjamin – 2018-04-15T03:30:40.207

1Europe is US ally. Also that is a suitable answer. – user4951 – 2018-04-15T03:38:30.740

1The sniper video is several months old, and has nothing to do with current riots. – ugoren – 2018-04-15T04:42:40.753



  1. It impinges on their sovereignty. States generally aren't very happy to have some random foreigners go investigate within their borders.

  2. The question makes an assumption that "third party" == "independent". And that "independent" == "fully objective and truthful".

    Neither of those assumptions are guaranteed. Most likely "independent" party would be the UN (which is extremely anti-Israel, for a variety of reasons not the least of which is the influence of Islamic states there).

  3. There is a definite information asymmetry that would make even a (impossible in reality) hypothetical fully objective and independent investigation impossible to do.

    One side is a fully democratic state that basically has almost no way to keep secrets. The other side is a theocratic terrorist state.

    How likely would an independent investigator be able to prove that someone that Israel alleges was a Hamas militant, was indeed that, if Hamas claims they were a civilian? It's not like they have uniforms, dog tags, and paperwork in triplicate that an independent judiciary can force them to hand over.

    So, Hamas says 100% of those killed are civilians. The very best an independent investigator can do is say "I don't have any firm independent proof of that". They can't prove it's a lie.


Posted 2018-04-15T02:55:33.943

Reputation: 84 347

2This answer, while basically true, has some inaccuracies. For example, why should a democratic state have “no way to keep secrets”? States do that all the time (national security, classified information, and so on). Also, while I certainly won’t dispute the characterization of Hamas as theocratic, Israel has some (milder) theocratic elements as well, e.g., the Orthodox control of Jewish marriage. (This assumes we’re using theocracy in the broad sense in both cases, and not taking about strict rule by religious authorities, whereby only a few countries, such as Iran, qualify). – Obie 2.0 – 2018-04-15T06:55:31.167

5Finally, Hamas also actually was democratically elected (and seems to still have democratic elements). Of course, that says nothing about the character of a government…plenty of autocrats and authoritarians are democratically elected, and democracies are fully capable of any kind of evil…but it is worth noting nonetheless that an organization can be a theocratic (in the broad sense) state sponsor of terrorism and still be democratic. – Obie 2.0 – 2018-04-15T07:03:04.620

2"the UN (which is extremely anti-Israel, for a variety of reasons not the least of which is the influence of Islamic states there)". This borders on conspiration theories. Note that the only islamic country in the UN Security Council is Kuwait (there is formally also Kasachstan, but this is a largely secular state that is neutral towards Israel). The influence of islamic countries on the UN is largely exaggerated, and several of those are currently also neutral or partly allied with Israel. Not to state that the US, the most powerful member of the UN, is an ally of Israel. – Thern – 2018-04-16T07:30:12.303

The rest of the post, however, seems reasonable. – Thern – 2018-04-16T07:33:39.537

Describing the Palestinians as a theocratic terrorist state, akin to ISIS, is a bit rich at the moment, but sooner or later it will become one, and there will be consequences. – Aethelbald – 2018-04-16T11:43:27.067

2I disagree with the decision to put this question on hold. The same question has been asked on the BBC. Is it the opinion of the adjudicators that the BBC should be put on hold? – Aethelbald – 2018-04-16T11:46:36.420

2@Thern er, the UN is not the just UN security council. The anti-Israel bias is not exaggerated at all; if it had extended to the security council it would be a magnitude of order worse, that is all. – None – 2018-04-16T12:45:24.047

1@Obie2.0 being democratic and winning an election once are very different things. – None – 2018-04-16T12:45:58.637

@Orangesandlemons The only resolution of the Security Council against Israel in the last ten years was a condemnation of the Israeli settlements which violate the Geneva convention according to the International Court of Justice. I doubt that this is enough proof for an "extreme anti-Israel bias" (I would expect something like denial of the right to exist for that), but we may discuss this at another opportunity where it is more on topic. – Thern – 2018-04-16T14:54:49.560

@Aethelbald I think the question should be reworded for that. Especially concerning the Middle East conflict, discussions are always heated and wording is very important. Maybe someone has a good idea to reword it in a neutral way. – Thern – 2018-04-16T15:42:20.077

@Aethelbald - not "Palestinians". Specfically, Hamas-controlled Gaza – user4012 – 2018-04-16T16:39:15.490

@Thern - Security Council isn't entire UN. Never mind the fact that there were many many resolutions even in UNSC, US simply vetoed them. – user4012 – 2018-04-16T16:40:27.283

@user4012, I'm not buying that line. – Aethelbald – 2018-04-16T16:45:10.380

@user4012 Well, I am looking forward to a discussion about this topic when an opportunity arises. I fear it is offtopic here, albeit interesting. – Thern – 2018-04-16T17:16:15.853